NJ Saltwater Fisherman Forums
NJ Saltwater Fisherman => Fisheries Management => Topic started by: Hotrod on March 01, 2012, 07:09:54 PM
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NJ Summer Flounder / Fluke Regulations
Option 5 Passes
The New Regs are as Follows..
17.5 inch @ 5 fish... May 5 - September 28 29%
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clp
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Option Five is May 5 to September 28 and Five fish at 17.5 inches.
This is INSANE!!!!!! You do not give up Three Fish for a lousy half an inch. We lost the Eight Fish bag once before and look how much money and time we spent to get it back. And research. And now we give it away for a lousy half an inch??????
The folks who voted for this will be sorry. Never give up three fish for a half an inch. Never. This is so lame!!!!
Here is the other thing. When The Obama White House says we are overfishing for Fluke in 2012....... 2013 NJ regulations will be a NY style regulation. Those of you who voted for Option Five will be sorry. Make all the money you can in 2012..... you will be out of business in 2013. That my friend is the bottom line!!!!!
Do we know the Black Sea Bass regulations for 2012?
Over and Out!!!
5hrug
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All I can say is enjoy it while you can. We gave up 3 fish per day for nothing.Everything the SSFFF (and us) did to get the bag limit bag up is wasted. And mark my words with the 17.5" length it will be claimed we greatly overfished. We will dearly pay for it in 2013.
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All I can say is enjoy it while you can. We gave up 3 fish per day for nothing.Everything the SSFFF (and us) did to get the bag limit bag up is wasted. And mark my words with the 17.5" length it will be claimed we greatly overfished. We will dearly pay for it in 2013.
I agree
I wanted Option 4
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All I can say is enjoy it while you can. We gave up 3 fish per day for nothing.Everything the SSFFF (and us) did to get the bag limit bag up is wasted. And mark my words with the 17.5" length it will be claimed we greatly overfished. We will dearly pay for it in 2013.
Exactly whs
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The "for hire" people that voted for Option Five for 2012 will be out of business in 2013. 2013 will be two fish at like 20.5 inches or more. And you will be out of business. Never give up three fish for a half an inch.
BTW, The Wharton School of Business called, they want their degree back......... What a joke!!!!
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clp clp couldnt agree with you guys more. Ive been saying this all along. Give the guys some meat that was the majorities cry, well you got what you wanted. Next year theyll be crying give the captains $ because theyll be out of buisness. Cant wait to see the amount of boats up for sale next year. You get what you wish for, a half inch fcp. what a joke
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
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I have to agree with Capt Carl. I don't see a half inch making that much difference. Wouldn't that leave more larger fluke available for breeding? I have heard that argument too. Shorter size limit less pressure on the breeders. :headscra:
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I don't think a single fluke regulation one year is going to put a guy out of business the following. I find that laughable. sorry, not trying to upset anyone, just repectfully disagree. I like to go on a charter with friends and family for the enjoyment, NOT to feed my family. Its much cheaper to walk into my local fishmarket and purchase my food than to fish for it.
Now, if you tell me fuel costs i can buy that one...its basically a domino effect. Fuel is going to make business raise costs AND fuel is then going to make the customer think twice about spending extra money (both travel costs & boat costs).
just my two cents.
as for the fluke regs. When i fish off my boat its me and one other adult. sometime two adults and my 8yo son. I can guarantee you that i won't be taking home ten or 15 fish...for what? I'm not trying to feed an army, just a few fresh fillets if possible for the dinner table.
I try and use circle hooks to lessen the gut hooks and decrease mortality in smaller hooked fish. I dont place my foot on the fish to remove the hook and I don't simple toss the fish overboard, i place it in the water until its good to go and release. i feel good catch and release tactics are better for the fishery than any reg will ever be. again, my two cents.
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Here is how I see it hurting. All last season we heard how everyone is throwing back fish 'just short' and if they were allowed 17 1/2" fish they would have limited out on most of their trips. I know I have caught my share of 'just short' fish the past few seasons.
Now, if we are to believe what pretty much EVERYONE was saying about that then there is a REAL possibility that we will overfish our quota by double or triple this season. If that were to happen what will the 2013 season be? ZERO fish!!!
So, that half inch can come back to bite us on the ass for next year. Hopefully I am wrong on this.
As far as it putting charter boats out of business, what else is in abundance to fish for in the summer? Do we now beat up on the seabass because we don't want blue fish?
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
you guys fight for the longer season and higher bag limits, then beg for lower sizes so customers can take something home... Well whats Capt Carl and the other boats gonna fish for next season when NO ONE wants to spend 600 +- dollars to keep what will eventually be 3 fish per man ??? its the bigger picture more than the need now....
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and i am NOT singling out you Capt Carl... but there are guys who support and actually were heavily involved in the SSFF, who helped raise moneys from people like me, to help lenghten the season and raise the bag limits, only to beg and support the cry to go backwards in the end ..... BS
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This year all the complaining will be that if the size limit was 17" they would have got their limit. The same guys who limited last year will limit this year, only with less fish.
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You guys know me better than that....i would not take anything personal.....no personal attack here....im am merely responding to a post.....and stating my opinion which i am entitled to just as anyone else is.
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I know this much all those just shorts last year are 18 this year so know well all catch our limits and over fish our quota forcing big brother to squeez us more. Great. fcp Id doesnt matter what the size limit is if your not using what works. Several people complaining that they couldnt catch keepers, well when you fish at the same spot with the same gear your gonna get the same results. Im by far a"sharpie" but I know one thing if theres no fish where your fishing move. Never the less I am looking foward to catching the flattiez especially that the water never really got cold. You can bet your but that if what I think will be there this year Ill be returning 17.5s to swim again. Good luck to everyone on the flatties. I will post pics and reports as it comes.
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All I can say is enjoy it while you can. We gave up 3 fish per day for nothing.Everything the SSFFF (and us) did to get the bag limit bag up is wasted. And mark my words with the 17.5" length it will be claimed we greatly overfished. We will dearly pay for it in 2013.
Mark my words, if you opted for a longer season then you would have overfished as well. People fail to understand that the highest reported landings come from the longest open seasons. Why do you think NY got penalized so greatly in the past? Remember if the season is open they will count that as fishing being landed even if there are storms preventing any landings of fluke.
Biologists have stated that the best way to constrain harvest is through season, not length. They don’t want you picking through 50 fish to get a keeper.
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Option Five is May 5 to September 28 and Five fish at 17.5 inches.
This is INSANE!!!!!! You do not give up Three Fish for a lousy half an inch. We lost the Eight Fish bag once before and look how much money and time we spent to get it back. And research. And now we give it away for a lousy half an inch??????
The folks who voted for this will be sorry. Never give up three fish for a half an inch. Never. This is so lame!!!!
The problem is the vast majority of fishermen do not ever come near the 8 limit. You're asking for regulations to benefit only a very small segment of the population. Thats just a fact.
When it comes down to either having a smaller size limit or less fish, smaller size limit is by far a better way to distribute the fish. This will help out surf guys, rental boats, kayaks, party boat guys and even most private boat guys.
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
very well said
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17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
Yes, I don't understand when i hear all these comments that now they'll have to take back 5 fish at 17.5".
If you were good enough last year to take 8 at 18" then by all means you should be able to keep 5 fish at well over 17.5". Take back 5 at 18", take back 3 at 18" and 2 at 19"....etc. Thats why its called a minimum size guys as the Capt stated.
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
very well said
gotta disagree nick... not about the 17.5 for me... its about going from 8 to 6 fish and looking at the future of possibly going to 3 which is a VERY GOOD POSSIBLITY.... seriously are you gonna take the Luna Sea 4 out of the slip for 3 fluke ???
if its about the longer/shorter season hurting the fluke numbers why didnt all the supporters just vote for option 6 then ?
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Cause option 6 is hanging in there for next year--only 2 fish at 17 :'( :'( :'(
And no offence to anyone--just looking at the past
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Cause option 6 is hanging in there for next year--only 2 fish at 17 :'( :'( :'(
And no offence to anyone--just looking at the past
EXACTLY MY POINT..... thanx
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Cause option 6 is hanging in there for next year--only 2 fish at 17 :'( :'( :'(
And no offence to anyone--just looking at the past
I thought it was 3 fish? ???
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3 2 1 fish it dont matter where being gouged this benefits NO ONE. the longer season isnt what we wanted we wanted a later season no one really fishes fluke till late May or June.
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Cause option 6 is hanging in there for next year--only 2 fish at 17 :'( :'( :'(
And no offence to anyone--just looking at the past
I thought it was 3 fish? ???
Yes it was 3 BUt next year 5hrug 5hrug 5hrug
There is no give and take
Sorry yes there is--WE give They take fcp :'( :'(
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3 2 1 fish it dont matter where being gouged this benefits NO ONE. the longer season isnt what we wanted we wanted a later season no one really fishes fluke till late May or June.
Southern Jersey does--as posted--you said water temps.
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the longer season isnt what we wanted we wanted a later season no one really fishes fluke till late May or June.
Who is "we"? Southern NJ guys wanted the season to open in April, they didn't get that either. The middleground is Early May/Late Sept as it should be. Lets not forget all the storms that move through the fall are going to be wasted fishing days that still count.
Oh and finally, the water temps this year are well above average. I believe we already at Mid April water temps.
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Cause option 6 is hanging in there for next year--only 2 fish at 17 :'( :'( :'(
And no offence to anyone--just looking at the past
EXACTLY MY POINT..... thanx
Yea Broken We know how good you are on the Fluke chrz chrz--And by no means a dig towards you--go get-em t^ t^
Some concerns are the people that fish from land and in rivers that can't afford a boat or like me --getting to old to keep the upkeep anymore.
I would rather see the larger limits then less size--In my opinion-and only mine would be better for the future--As I posted 6@ 17--17.5 would be fine--but that 5 number had be worried
Just my .02
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Just a quesation from a novice. But dont the larger females produce most of the eggs? It seems to me the smaller ones are easier to catch. So most fisherman are going to keep what they can that will leave the bigger ones to breed. Now from what I see most of the fisherman last year weren't caughting their limit. That seem to get more than a few people a little pissed. Now if people can start going home with more fish won't that make more people happy and coming back? Just a thought.
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Just a quesation from a novice. But dont the larger females produce most of the eggs? It seems to me the smaller ones are easier to catch. So most fisherman are going to keep what they can that will leave the bigger ones to breed. Now from what I see most of the fisherman last year weren't caughting their limit. That seem to get more than a few people a little pissed. Now if people can start going home with more fish won't that make more people happy and coming back? Just a thought.
First Welcome t^--Great people here t^
To answer your ???,s Do a serch on here There is No answer--The way they figure regs. needs to be changed--
This is for everyone
Go and look how they figure the regs.
Short version
Ck at the dock
call people
Divide X 2
Then figure how many fish were caught
So what you have is
At the dock--limited out
phone calls no one caught
or vise veras
We just need a better way
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i understand that the water temps are up which is good. But who knew we Nj was gonna be Fla this year? So next year when the winter goez back to normal you mean to tell me youll be fishing for skinny , spotty, finiky fluke in april :headscra :headscra: if so your better than me. Ill catch stripers till the end of may then switch to fluke when there bigger and more alive. I dont know how the fishing is from the canal or anywhere south of the hook, but here where I fish the stripers are better option early spring.
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i understand that the water temps are up which is good. But who knew we Nj was gonna be Fla this year?
Anybody that stuck their head out the window knew weeks in advance that this was a warm winter.
So next year when the winter goez back to normal you mean to tell me youll be fishing for skinny , spotty, finiky fluke in april
No, we said fishermen in South NJ are the ones who want an April opener. Yes historically in the backbays the water warms up fast down south and doormats can be pulled from the mudflats there. Just look on a map, geographically speaking Southern NJ is much different than the North. Tons of mudflats, creeks, marshes....etc. The Southern guys swear that the best fishing on the year for them is the early season many times.
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i understand that the water temps are up which is good. But who knew we Nj was gonna be Fla this year?
Anybody that stuck their head out the window knew weeks in advance that this was a warm winter.
So next year when the winter goez back to normal you mean to tell me youll be fishing for skinny , spotty, finiky fluke in april
No, we said fishermen in South NJ are the ones who want an April opener. Yes historically in the backbays the water warms up fast down south and doormats can be pulled from the mudflats there. Just look on a map, geographically speaking Southern NJ is much different than the North. Tons of mudflats, creeks, marshes....etc. The Southern guys swear that the best fishing on the year for them is the early season many times.
YUP and I live in PA--But my Bud that lives in Mystic Is. and north-shares the same opinions--Wish we still had 3 areas in NJ NCS :-*
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I'd like to thank Broken for his insight. The government gave you 8 fish at 18 inches from Derby Day to October. They gave it to you. The Big Time Party Boats agreed and wanted Option Two. Voyager, Jamaica to name a couple. The RFA-NJ representatives wanted Option Five. If you don't believe me, look at the other NJ site and read about it. A person who attended the meeting gave some votes from those in attendance.
So, if you are angry about Option Five and are a RFA-NJ member, you have something to think about.
When SSFFF started a lot of us sent money, spent time, wrote letters and all kinds of stuff to get a better season and to keep our original eight fish bag. We got it back. Now, some folks gave it all away when once again, government was willing to give us 8 fish at 18 inches and a season from early May to October. Like we used to have BTW before government got involved. But some folks at the meeting, gave it all away.
I hope I am wrong, Captain Carl. But if we look like NY in 2013........ I won't say I told you so. I just hope government says to you Captain Carl, "Hey, you were willing to take 5 at 17.5, you will agree with 2 at 20.5".
Another thing. I know 18 inches is a big fish. So is 17.5. But if a minor leaguer like me can catch them, I am sure some of you and your customers can. Broken and his crew are very good. I read his posts. I fish on a party boat and fish with the best fluke fishermen in the state. I learned from them. Teach your children well........
The bottom line is, you do not give up three fish for a half an inch, when the government is giving it you and you turn it down.
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I'd like to thank Broken for his insight. The government gave you 8 fish at 18 inches from Derby Day to October. They gave it to you. The Big Time Party Boats agreed and wanted Option Two. Voyager, Jamaica to name a couple. The RFA-NJ representatives wanted Option Five. If you don't believe me, look at the other NJ site and read about it. A person who attended the meeting gave some votes from those in attendance.
So, if you are angry about Option Five and are a RFA-NJ member, you have something to think about.
When SSFFF started a lot of us sent money, spent time, wrote letters and all kinds of stuff to get a better season and to keep our original eight fish bag. We got it back. Now, some folks gave it all away when once again, government was willing to give us 8 fish at 18 inches and a season from early May to October. Like we used to have BTW before government got involved. But some folks at the meeting, gave it all away.
I hope I am wrong, Captain Carl. But if we look like NY in 2013........ I won't say I told you so. I just hope government says to you Captain Carl, "Hey, you were willing to take 5 at 17.5, you will agree with 2 at 20.5".
Another thing. I know 18 inches is a big fish. So is 17.5. But if a minor leaguer like me can catch them, I am sure some of you and your customers can. Broken and his crew are very good. I read his posts. I fish on a party boat and fish with the best fluke fishermen in the state. I learned from them. Teach your children well........
The bottom line is, you do not give up three fish for a half an inch, when the government is giving it you and you turn it down.
The RFA & RFA-NJ did not offer an opinion to any of the options that were given. If you were at the meeting, you would know that no one represented the RFA or RFA-NJ.
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Just keep this in mind.
No matter what way the regulations went there would be people who did not like the results. Seems like there was about a 50/50 split between those who wanted option 2 and those who wanted option 5. If option 2 was chosen then the people who wanted option 5 would be the ones sounding off about the result. Unfortunately, not everyone can win.
There is no blame to be placed on any one individual or group for the results. We all had an opportunity to express our opinion. But if you still insist on placing blame, then place it on those who did not attend the meeting and have their voice heard and not on those who voiced their opinion as to what they thought was the best option.
Yes, I realize that many people can not make meetings like this due to work, family matters and other obligations. Such is a fact of life. We all have our priorities with many priorities coming before our sport, rightly so. Perhaps in the future a change can be made in their method of deciding what the majority want. At this point we must all register with the state to fish. Maybe, just maybe, they can add a line to the registration asking for our vote on what we favor for the regs. 5hrug
Just for the record. I wanted option 2.
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Just keep this in mind.
No matter what way the regulations went there would be people who did not like the results. Seems like there was about a 50/50 split between those who wanted option 2 and those who wanted option 5. If option 2 was chosen then the people who wanted option 5 would be the ones sounding off about the result. Unfortunately, not everyone can win.
There is no blame to be placed on anyone individual or group for the results. We all had an opportunity to express our opinion. But if you still insist on placing blame, then place it on those who did not attend the meeting and have their voice heard and not on those who voiced their opinion as to what they thought was the best option.
Yes, I realize that many people can not make meetings like this due to work, family matters and other obligations. Such is a fact of life. We all have our priorities with many priorities coming before our sport, rightly so. Perhaps in the future a change can be made in their method of deciding what the majority want. At this point we must all register with the state to fish. Maybe, just maybe, they can add a line to the registration asking for our vote on what we favor for the regs. 5hrug
Just for the record. I wanted option 2.
I wish they would do something like that. clp I also wish that you would see more enforcement on poaching and illegal harvest.
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IRISH--you got it--Woulda Shoulda Coulda---Well if that were the case indeed!!!Would be great for US/WE to have a say in the vote--BUT and I will Quote from my post on here in just got this--The Chief himself said "it is not a public vote with the option getting the most "votes" at the Council meeting being selected. "
http://njsaltwaterfisherman.com/forums/index.php?topic=26100.0
Maybe now that we have to register every year they could post a public comment or poll for what the people would want for regulations--and /or get a real idea of what all the fishermen really did catch--that would save a ton of money without going to docks and phone calls.
Nuff said--We got what we have this year lets enjoy it and work do do what we can for next.
NOW GO FISHING--Seems like Capt. Carl is the only one that did clp
OH YEA--saw NY gets 3 fish @ 20.5 this year
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Just my 2 cents, but why wouldn't a slot work like they did with the red fish in the south? Say a slot of 18" to 22" any below or over goes back and you'd have your breeders and a stock for the following year.
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Because Fluke reach sexual maturity at age 2 which is usually 15-20" and the usually stop reproducing at 6 years which is normally 24-29".
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In the original list of options there was an option for a slot fish. From my understanding, this option was removed from the final list because the Conservation Officers deemed it too hard to enforce. They said that if they boarded a party boat they would have to go thru the entire set of 'racks' that the mates must save from when they fillet fish at sea. They would then have to determine the number of people on the boat and from that determine the number of slot 'racks' that would be permissible, who the rack belonged to, ets. They thought that this would cause mass confusion, rebellion, whatever. 5hrug
Here is my simple solution:
The option given was one fish at 17" and three fish at 18". If that had been brought forward this is what could have been done for easy enforcement.
First off, as is is now, if the mates fillet your fish at sea they must keep all 'racks' for proof of size. Simply add to the regulation that if the mate fillets a slot fish (only one is allowed per patron) the 'rack' for the slot fish shall be given back to the angler and that rack must be retained by the angler until he disembarks from the vessel. If a CO were to board the party boat he could conduct business as usual checking the individual anglers, racks, etc.
With very little effort they could have thought this out just as I have. No confusion or anything else.
Can people cheat and toss a rack away? Of course, but the majority won't. I don't see a reason for them to do so, but I guess some can have a reason. If someone is out to circumvent the law they will do so no matter what the regulations are.
Just my simple answer to what they deemed an unenforceable situation.
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I'd like to thank Broken for his insight. The government gave you 8 fish at 18 inches from Derby Day to October. They gave it to you. The Big Time Party Boats agreed and wanted Option Two. Voyager, Jamaica to name a couple. The RFA-NJ representatives wanted Option Five. If you don't believe me, look at the other NJ site and read about it. A person who attended the meeting gave some votes from those in attendance.
So, if you are angry about Option Five and are a RFA-NJ member, you have something to think about.
When SSFFF started a lot of us sent money, spent time, wrote letters and all kinds of stuff to get a better season and to keep our original eight fish bag. We got it back. Now, some folks gave it all away when once again, government was willing to give us 8 fish at 18 inches and a season from early May to October. Like we used to have BTW before government got involved. But some folks at the meeting, gave it all away.
I hope I am wrong, Captain Carl. But if we look like NY in 2013........ I won't say I told you so. I just hope government says to you Captain Carl, "Hey, you were willing to take 5 at 17.5, you will agree with 2 at 20.5".
Another thing. I know 18 inches is a big fish. So is 17.5. But if a minor leaguer like me can catch them, I am sure some of you and your customers can. Broken and his crew are very good. I read his posts. I fish on a party boat and fish with the best fluke fishermen in the state. I learned from them. Teach your children well........
The bottom line is, you do not give up three fish for a half an inch, when the government is giving it you and you turn it down.
Well said.... again its not about 5 or 8 fish today... its about bending over next season as the potential is there for drastic cuts in the keeper limit amount... no one else see's this 5hrug
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That is the very reason I wanted option 2. Last year many people said that if the size limit was 17 1/2" they would have limited out on most trips. If that were the case or will be the case this year, how much are we going to go over our quota this year? Hopefully we won't.
The deed is done for this year. We can only hope for the best.
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Its simple.. you cant keep giving numbers back!! Just remember that commercial quota is 16"s... and should include their deadloss....
The other thing I dont like pick a number for a 5 yrs plan.. Every year the regs get changed.. its BS
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Joey, I hate to break it to you but the commercial quota is 14". thud
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Better yet...between the fisheries management n Obama administrator were F'd
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That is the very reason I wanted option 2. Last year many people said that if the size limit was 17 1/2" they would have limited out on most trips. If that were the case or will be the case this year, how much are we going to go over our quota this year? Hopefully we won't.
The deed is done for this year. We can only hope for the best.
If thats the case why is everyone keep crying that we are giving fish back when everyone is afraid more fish will be kept? ???
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Because it will be relentless, If so many people had a hard time catching keepers last year the 8 bag only matter for those who were lucky enough to get them. This year at 17.5 Alot more people will be able to limit out. So if last year Average was 1.5 per man this year it should be around 3.5 if all of those just shorts last year where actually just short. thats almost triple last years catch and last year they said we over caught which means next year we could be in trouble. The argument is you dont give 3 fish away for a half inch, not because everyone wants to be able too keep 8 fish (which is nice) but because it took so much to get to that limit and it will take forever to get it back.
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I give up
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This year at 17.5 Alot more people will be able to limit out. So if last year Average was 1.5 per man this year it should be around 3.5 if all of those just shorts last year where actually just short.
Yes but thats a pretty simplified calculation. I'd say the reality is somewhere in the middle. Remember how everyone kept saying "now that its 17.5" people will be complaining they are catching tons of 17" fish" I highly doubt we are going to see a lot of limiting out because of this. More fish will be taken no doubt
Again its a lot of conflicting talk from all people. One person says "why give up 3 fish for a lousy .5" that half inch isn't that much", the other says "oh no now we're going to over-fish since everyone is going to limit out". Truth is usually somewhere in the middle.
The argument is you dont give 3 fish away for a half inch, not because everyone wants to be able too keep 8 fish (which is nice) but because it took so much to get to that limit and it will take forever to get it back.
The same can be said for why you don't give away size. People said we wouldn't never get back under 18" and here we are. The size limit is smaller than last year and the season slightly longer. Pretty good progress i'd say.
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Because it will be relentless, If so many people had a hard time catching keepers last year the 8 bag only matter for those who were lucky enough to get them. This year at 17.5 Alot more people will be able to limit out. So if last year Average was 1.5 per man this year it should be around 3.5 if all of those just shorts last year where actually just short. thats almost triple last years catch and last year they said we over caught which means next year we could be in trouble. The argument is you dont give 3 fish away for a half inch, not because everyone wants to be able too keep 8 fish (which is nice) but because it took so much to get to that limit and it will take forever to get it back.
The average last year is 1.7 and dropping the size the average goes to 2.3 or 2.4. Just to let you know.
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I give up as well, If it was 22" Im gonna catch keepers
So know that it is 5 at 17.5 just makes it much much easier. good luck this year.
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I give up as well, If it was 22" Im gonna catch keepers
So know that it is 5 at 17.5 just makes it much much easier. good luck this year.
Yes good luck to all. Remember this isn't a doomsday scenario. Look at the positives...Size limit is down .5" and we get some extra days. You can still take home 10 fillets which is plenty. NJ historically has done a decent job of matching its regulations to the quota so lets see how this plays out.
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Because it will be relentless, If so many people had a hard time catching keepers last year the 8 bag only matter for those who were lucky enough to get them. This year at 17.5 Alot more people will be able to limit out. So if last year Average was 1.5 per man this year it should be around 3.5 if all of those just shorts last year where actually just short. thats almost triple last years catch and last year they said we over caught which means next year we could be in trouble. The argument is you dont give 3 fish away for a half inch, not because everyone wants to be able too keep 8 fish (which is nice) but because it took so much to get to that limit and it will take forever to get it back.
The average last year is 1.7 and dropping the size the average goes to 2.3 or 2.4. Just to let you know.
Yeah, thats sounds more logical than over 3 per trip. They already took that into account for the options.
If you vote option 5 for the longer season that takes a hit into the quota as a risk as well. I read that October fluke dates carry double the weight in how the National Marine Fisheries Service calculates catch data, so each fish caught that month would count as two. nosmly
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Because it will be relentless, If so many people had a hard time catching keepers last year the 8 bag only matter for those who were lucky enough to get them. This year at 17.5 Alot more people will be able to limit out. So if last year Average was 1.5 per man this year it should be around 3.5 if all of those just shorts last year where actually just short. thats almost triple last years catch and last year they said we over caught which means next year we could be in trouble. The argument is you dont give 3 fish away for a half inch, not because everyone wants to be able too keep 8 fish (which is nice) but because it took so much to get to that limit and it will take forever to get it back.
The average last year is 1.7 and dropping the size the average goes to 2.3 or 2.4. Just to let you know.
Yeah, thats sounds more logical than over 3 per trip. They already took that into account for the options.
If you vote option 5 for the longer season that takes a hit into the quota as a risk as well. I read that October fluke dates carry double the weight in how the National Marine Fisheries Service calculates catch data, so each fish caught that month would count as two. nosmly
You are correct Oct counts as double
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What we REALLY need is a better way to manage the managers. :P
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My brother and I caught about 800 flounder last year, three keepers. I would'nt mind putting a few more on the table this year. We had many days where we caught over twenty fluke,with most being over sixteen inches. We'll see how it goes this year and evaluate and reflect in the fall. Good fishing everyone.
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wa FISHERMAN FRAN slt
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
you guys fight for the longer season and higher bag limits, then beg for lower sizes so customers can take something home... Well whats Capt Carl and the other boats gonna fish for next season when NO ONE wants to spend 600 +- dollars to keep what will eventually be 3 fish per man ??? its the bigger picture more than the need now....
Tom,
You are right on the money. And you too IrishAyes. What a joke. Time is money and being on the water for as long as I can get keeps me and my mates "out of the unemployment" line. Does that make sense? Conservatively, this outcry cost me at least $15,000 dollars in lost charters for the month of October. That might not be a lot of money to some of you guys, but it's the difference between staying open and closing shop next year. Do you understand that?
Carl, you talk about fluke not being the only fish in NJ. Have you seen the crowds of people who fish the party boats when the fluke season opens......elbow to elbow. FLUKE IS THE PRIME NJ FISH whether you care to admit it or not. And I may add with the drastic decline of Striped Bass over the past 3 years (see the Muller video) who are you going to take out when next years fluke season is 3 fish at 20". One more thing....you talk about NY charter business....have you been to Sheepshead Bay lately?
Remember, it's not total poundage, but number of fish taken (1,090,000) I believe was the number?
To the guys who fish Sandy Hook,,,,what are you gonna do when all the boats vacuum the area and in July all you're catching is 14 & 15" fish? Change the reg's to 2 @ 15".
If you get the feeling I'm pissed, you're damn right. It's my livehood we're talking about here guys.
Like I said before, time is money! Not only for me but for ALL the other charter guys, party boat guys, bait and tackle stores, hotels, marinas, restaurants and so on and so forth. All because a couple guys can't find 18" fish. Oh brother!
Thanks!
p.s. Please don't go slammin me for this post because I refuse to take this any further. I've said my piece and I'm done.
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Honestly i agree i was pushing for option 4 for exactly the reasons you listed. Maybe i didnt limit out everyday or whatever but i didnt find it that hard to find 18" that i needed a half inch size reduction. They are out there. and some people say they are only in deep water what about the bay guys i call i call bull crap i caught more keepers this past season in the bay than i did in deep water to be honest just. Cant just hop on one drift get skunked and cry the blues... Just got to find em thats part of the fun ;D
I really hope we dont end up like new york next year fcp
Theres a guy at my marina a much better fisherman than me who went out every weekend with his son (age 6) and limited out almost trip most of his fish were easy 19"+ they are out there if he can do it anybody can
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I don't mean to Pee anybody off but what would it matter that the size was dropped half inch and the limit to 5 people will not go a party boats to fish cause it's 3 less fish .I only fish the surf an fished 3 -4 times a week all last year from sandy hook to ibsp an caught several but only had 4 keepers all season.Between gas ,tolls ,bait,an one parking ticket I could have went to the store an bought fish already cleaned.I thought this was a sport an not I need to catch fish or my family will starve.maybe people will fish less cause of the price of gass an the toll hike will hurt at least for me it will which will keep me closer to home an fresh water fish more which is catch an release all.
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Ok...time for me to chime in....G.A.F. that was about the most far fetched comment i ever heard....the charter business does not survive on Fluke Fishing...its a Part of the overall picture...not the whole business.... Did all the Charter boats in New York go out of business when they raised the Fluke size limit in New York? Hardly. I think the ridiculous price of gasoline will put fisherman out of business before a size limit will ...bit noone wants to talk about that.
We talk about losing 3 fish on the bag limit.....3 fish that very few ever caught to begin with......
The season length is about the same as last year...which everyone was happy as hell with.....now all of september isnt good enough all of a sudden?
For the last few years we all heard how much BS it was since the 18 inch limit was put into place.....now that its 17.5 thats all BS too?
We can all regulate ourselves if we want....17.5 is a MINIMUM size.....if you feel that strongly about it, when you go fishing just keep the fish that are 18 and over if thats what you want to do....nothing wrong with that!!!
you guys fight for the longer season and higher bag limits, then beg for lower sizes so customers can take something home... Well whats Capt Carl and the other boats gonna fish for next season when NO ONE wants to spend 600 +- dollars to keep what will eventually be 3 fish per man ??? its the bigger picture more than the need now....
Tom,
You are right on the money. And you too IrishAyes. What a joke. Time is money and being on the water for as long as I can get keeps me and my mates "out of the unemployment" line. Does that make sense? Conservatively, this outcry cost me at least $15,000 dollars in lost charters for the month of October. That might not be a lot of money to some of you guys, but it's the difference between staying open and closing shop next year. Do you understand that?
Carl, you talk about fluke not being the only fish in NJ. Have you seen the crowds of people who fish the party boats when the fluke season opens......elbow to elbow. FLUKE IS THE PRIME NJ FISH whether you care to admit it or not. And I may add with the drastic decline of Striped Bass over the past 3 years (see the Muller video) who are you going to take out when next years fluke season is 3 fish at 20". One more thing....you talk about NY charter business....have you been to Sheepshead Bay lately?
Remember, it's not total poundage, but number of fish taken (1,090,000) I believe was the number?
To the guys who fish Sandy Hook,,,,what are you gonna do when all the boats vacuum the area and in July all you're catching is 14 & 15" fish? Change the reg's to 2 @ 15".
If you get the feeling I'm pissed, you're damn right. It's my livehood we're talking about here guys.
Like I said before, time is money! Not only for me but for ALL the other charter guys, party boat guys, bait and tackle stores, hotels, marinas, restaurants and so on and so forth. All because a couple guys can't find 18" fish. Oh brother!
Thanks!
p.s. Please don't go slammin me for this post because I refuse to take this any further. I've said my piece and I'm done.
And you are welcome to post as you feel. Without any personal backlash from anyone t^ Everyone has different opinions on this topic.. so let them be said t^
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It's all about the head boats. People are tired of spending $50-$70 & comming home w/ nothing. I fish out of Great Kills so I'm use to searching for the big ones.
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woo hoo striper!!!....im not drifting for fluke! Tuna hear I come in October with Kenny's beer!!! Thats my two cents! chrz chrz