YOUR Outdoors is slowly being DISMANTLED!

[apmaurosr]

YOUR Outdoors is Slowly Being DISMANTLED!!!!
__________________________________________________ __
* ARE YOU UPSET ABOUT THE SEA BASS CLOSURE?

* Angry if there are no more fish to catch in our ocean?
* Furious about a bear injuring or killing a child?

* Frustrated with animal rights activists influencing fishing & hunting policy in NJ?

* Concerned about our forests dying from from lack of attention?

* Fearful that NJ might abandon upland bird & freshwater fish stocking for lack of funds?

* Outraged by Trenton raiding the funds meant for the health of our outdoors?


If so...

R.O.O.R. and be HEARD!!!
Rescue Our Outdoors Rally!
Save YOUR Great Outdoors from being DISMANTLED!

IT'S TIME THE MASSES ARE HEARD!!
THIS IS AN EVENT NOT TO BE MISSED!
The largest gathering of fishermen, hunters, hikers, bird-watchers, divers, foresters, etc. EVER!
Demand recognition!
Act Now, it may be our last chance!!!!!!

IF YOU CARE - YOU'LL BE THERE! SEND THIS TO (10) FRIENDS THAT FEEL AS YOU DO!
Don't stop this e-mail if you derive pleasure from New Jersey's great woods and waters.
New Jersey Outdoor Alliance
Presents

Rescue Our Outdoors Rally!
Saturday, October 24, 2009 * 2:00PM
New Egypt Speedway * Free Admission!

720 Pinehurst Rd, Rt 539 New Egypt, NJ 08533

~ Seating for 6,000 people - bring lawn chairs for expected overflow ~


Music, noted outdoor speakers, Special guest Chris Christie
Rescue Our Outdoors Rally!... and be heard by Trenton
Learn all of the details:

http://www.njoutdooralliance.org/whe...oorsrally.html

I'll see you on the 24th!

Anthony P. Mauro, Sr.
Chairman,
New Jersey Outdoor Alliance: "We've got your back!"
JOIN NJOA: http://www.njoutdooralliance.org/support/njoa.html

[CaptTB]

I received this notice by e-mail a couple days ago. While I whole heartedly support the NJOA's efforts in our state for hunting and fishing, I felt the use of the Sea Bass Closure to drum up support was a bit misleading.

If you look at the attached brochure to the e-mail notice it says absolutely nothing about NMFS or the MAFMC or NOAA.

What it does say is:

WHY THEY SHOULD ATTEND:
Trenton is slowly dismantling New Jersey’s
Great Outdoors!
■ Trenton is substituting an animal rights agenda and
environmentalism for fi sh and game management
■ Trenton is raiding the budget of the department that
oversees fishing and hunting - cutting staff to
dangerous levels
■ Trenton’s preservation policies are harming our forests
■ Trenton is blocking recreational anglers from
New Jersey’s artificial reefs
■ Trenton is taking funds meant for outdoor activities and spending the monies elsewhere

And it ends at the bottom with: LET TRENTON HEAR YOUR VOICE!

However, Trenton not only has nothing to do with the Sea Bass closure, but "Trenton" as in the state on NJ actually voted AGAINST CLOSING SEA BASS IN STATE WATERS.

This is part of what the meeting with the handful of guys on my boat the other day was about. Staying focused, but knowing not just what the problem is, but who is causing the problem and how to deal with it. Trenton not only has nothing to do with Sea Bass being closed, neither Trenton nor any of the Politicians in Trenton even have any say in the matter. This is a Federal issue done by the National Marine Fisheries Service, of which Trenton has no control over or say in. Our US politicians in Washington, DC, not Trenton, are the ones we need to deal with. The science and the politics at the federal level are what is causing this problem. Trenton also has no say in those things.

Attend this meeting/rally, NJOA has done wonders for hunters and I completely support those efforts, and all the other things mentioned in the release are important and need to be dealt with. Again, I support those efforts 100%.

But, talking to Trenton will not deal with or solve the problems surrounding the Sea Bass closure. In fact, the two things have nothing to do with each other.

[apmaurosr]

I disagree captainTB

Here's why: while there is merit in your sea bass statement the larger picture is that it was NJ reprsentatives (Governor, US Senator) that circumvented NJ fishing stakeholders and put Mr. Christopher J. Zeman on MARFMC.

We will have Federal legislators speaking as well as state legislators at our rally. It is the Governor who is part of the nomination process and it was Governor Corzine that was part of a process that circumvented existing protocol and fishing stakeholders. Did Zeman have a say in the sea bass closure? Perhaps not, but he may be in position to have a say in future matters. I believe sea bass is relevant.

I believe ALL fisherman have a stake in the matter. Perhaps a future closure can be avoided with proper resources being used at the state level and by legitimate appointees nominated by state government.

Here's some insight as to how the Zeman end-run around the fishing community worked:

Changes made on fishing board
By Kirk Moore /Asbury Park Press

Federal oceans administrator Jane Lubchenco is making changes on the Mid-Atlantic Regional Fishery Management Council, replacing fishermen who have represented three states with new members who have connections to environmental causes.

Christopher J. Zeman, a River Vale attorney who represented the environmental group Oceana on issues including sea turtles and their interactions with the scallop fleet, was named by the Department of Commerce to replace Edward Goldman, a recreational angler from Absecon whose term on the council expired this year. Each year around this time the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration headed by Lubchenco names members to the eight regional fishery councils based on nominations submitted by state governors.

For a New York State seat, Laurie Nolan, a commercial tilefish boat owner from Montauk, is being replaced with Peter Schafer, director of retail operations at the Wild Edibles fish stores in New York City. Schafer has promoted selling sustainable fish in those high-end outlets, and worked with writer and activist Carl Safina's Long Island-based Blue Ocean Institute to distribute shopping guides that tell consumers how their seafood choices affect the marine environment.

For a Virginia seat, Peter L. deFur, a professor at Virginia Commonmwealth University's Center for Environmental Studies is replacing angler Jeff Deem. DeFur is a wildlife toxicologist who works on risk assessment and coastal restoration issues, and has served on the Board of the Science and Environmental Health Network and as president of the Association for Science in the Public Interest.

Environmental groups have long contended the federal system of eight regional councils is too dominated by people with direct economic and personal stakes in fisheries issues, and have pressed NOAA to broaden the pool of nominees. In the 1990s Safina became the first Mid-Atlantic council member from an environmental background to serve a three-year term.

But on the New England front — scene of America's most intractable fishing problems — Lubchenco is not making big changes at the regional council. Four incumbent members have been renamed to new terms, along with newcomer Glen A. Libby from the Port Clyde commercial fishermen's cooperative in Maine.

[CaptTB]

Sorry Anthony, but Mr. Zeman was not voting at the August MAFMC meeting where the decision was made, and neither were any of the other new council members. They do not get sworn in until the October meeting.

Yes, The Governor sends the list to DC, but your are incorrect in your statement as to whio "put" mr. Zeman on the MAFMC. The Secretary of Commerce, not the Governor of a state, has the one and only say in who goes onto the council.

As for circumventing NJ stakeholders, the fact that Mr. GOldman's name, the incumbent council member, was removed from the list on the obligatory seat and put on the at large seat is as much the fault of NJ groups screwing with the list to get their own person on it as anyone else.

I'm afraid you mistake local politics for the "bigger picture" Mr. Mauro. That's not your fault, it is simply a result of you not having been involved in fisheries management at the ASMFC or MAFMC level to date. You'll learn, as I and many others were forced to do, but it takes time.

And since you continue to try and foist the idea on people that Trenton is somehow responsible for our problems with Sea Bass, even though nothing could be further from the truth, I will reiterate a point.

The council members that are going to be replaced by Mr. Zeman and others voted FOR the motion that the SSC revisit the Sea Bass quota. It was other, already sitting members FROM STATES OTHER THAN NJ that voted against it.

I would suggest a look through the meeting minutes to bring yourself up to speed on what transpired. I will gladly send you a copy of them if you wish.

As I stated before, talking to Trenton about the Sea Bass closure is a waste of time, since a) Trenton voted to keep sea bass open in state waters, and b) Trenton has no say at the MAFMC level. Our Trenton Politicians are state representatives and Senators, not US Congressman and Senators. The NMFS answers to Congress, not Trenton or any other state government.

The state has a seat on the ASMFC through the F&W director. Until such time as he/she is another "anti-fishing" entity, we are not talking about a NJ issue here. Keeping the Politicians honest in this state is vital, and I have commended you in the past for doing so and will continue to do so and a group like NJOA is vital to help keep our F&W from being overrun by the anti fishing lobby. In that you can certainly say Trenton is important in fisheries issues, that I would never deny.

Meanwhile, the people and groups that deal with the ASMFC and more importantly with Sea Bass the NMFS and MAFMC now have to spend time trying to explain to people why they need to support the actions being taken by those groups to fight the closure instead of attending a rally that has nothing to do with the topic.

I had hoped to make it simple to people that the rally was important for all the other reasons listed in the flyer/announcement, but to stay focused on Sea Bass elsewhere.

Since you insist on putting forth incorrect information, I will continue to correct you.

While I have not to date, perhaps in the future I will see NJOA representatives at and ASMFC or MAFMC meeting. Then perhaps you would know who actually voted for what, when they take office and how the system actually works.

Tony Bogan

[CaptTB]

Let me add a few more comments. Sorry for the long diatribe, but the FACTS need to be put forth to counter the SPIN.

I originally stated that I support NJOA's efforts at the state level, and continue to do so.

And, Mr. Mauro is correct that what happens in TRenton can affect us at all levels. Obviously what starts at home can spread outside the home.

Again, that's why I said I supported NJOA's efforts.

If all three names on the list from the Governor are, for example, Pew Fellows, then that would certainly be a bad thing at the MAFMC level. Of course, that's where local/state lobbying efforts come in, like what the RFA and NJOA and JCAA do.

However, in this specific case, which is exactly what I was referring to, the council member from the state is there for the next 3 years. Nothing that happens in Trenton this month or next month is going to effect the Sea Bass closure, period. Nor was it responsible for what happened in the first place. As I said, the council members that were recently appointed have not yet been sworn in or voted on anything. I would have expected Mr. Mauro to know that fact.

I never said that the rally would have nothing to do with salt water fisheries. I merely stated, correctly, that Trenton has no say at the MAFMC. I was referring to this issue with Sea Bass, as I thought I had made clear.

I had a meeting with a number of concerned fishermen the other night, and one of the things I mentioned was the various NJ groups trying to garner support, and doing so at the expense of a given cause or effort by diluting the message and wasting valuable time having to explain to people what is or is not happening and why.

Little did I know that only a day or two later I would see it happen again.
Sea Bass, they are not managed in Trenton. Trenton will not be making any decisions about Sea Bass in federal waters. Trenton will not be appointing any council member this year. Trenton cannot overturn or circumvent this federal waters closure. Trenton politicians have no vote or say at the federal level, although they can certainly make their feelings known to the US House and Senate, as they have done in the past. It never hurts to have more people speaking in favor of your position. But, they are NOT the ones who will make the decision in this case.

That was my point. If we are talking about the "future" issues we will deal with yadda yadda then that is another story. The topic was "Are you upset about the Sea Bass Closure?"

Are we clear?

Are we clear?