BAD NEWS FLUKE FANS! NMFS Wants a 40% Quota Cut in 2008!!!

[ped579]

Hi Ed,

Boy that is scary. 

Oceans 11, is that the plan Australia has been playing around with?

http://www.acfonline.org.au/uploads/res_marine_oceans_11.pdf

Or is there something closer to home that we should be aware of?

Happy Catching

Paul

[Capt. Ed]

Hi Paul,

Oceans 21 (sorry for the typo before) ...

Oceans Conservation, Education and Strategy for the 21st Century Act (H.R. 2939)

It is a law being circulated that basically says that the Ocean needs to be treated as a whole ecosystem. It adds more layers of Mis-Management all under the guise that it will help fisheries management.

BTW, Jim Saxton is on of the four people who introduced this legislation ... maybe this week woke him up!

Please see short, executive summary in the Word document attached to this post.

I do not think it has a link to any other initiative around the world.

Ed

[crabcake]

This is very sad and getting ridiculous. 

[fishon42]

I would still fish for fluke in the 2008 season. Forget them  I dont even quite understand what this 40% quota is. Will someone explain what it means ? A NO fluke season is just ridiculous.. lets take a stand to this and walk around with posters on the streets!!!




Fish On

[Luna Sea 5]

HMMM.. well, there isn't any way to put this without controversy.  I hate these restrictions, but I can't let it prevent me from being on the water.  I don't fish for a living, so this will not affect me as much as the Charter companies.  BUT, if they tighten up on the limits, we can still catch and release.  Most of us here fish for the sport and the meat, they can try to take the meat away from us but they can't take the SPORT part away from us.  Look at the fresh water fisherman... they catch and release all the time.  Trust me, I want the meat as well as the next guy, but I will never let them take the SPORT away from me. I know Charter companies don't agree with this,,,, but please hear me, I am not agreeing to this either.  As a sport fisherman, I need to be on the water one way or another...

[fishon42]

Yeah, basically the best feeling is to have that fish hit your pole and to set the hook. That is the most fun about it, being able to get a keeper size fish is just a bonus!! 


P.S
Even though Fluke is amazing to eat 
I think everything will be alright




Fish On

[Luna Sea 5]

Yeah, basically the best feeling is to have that fish hit your pole and to set the hook. That is the most fun about it, being able to get a keeper size fish is just a bonus!! 


P.S
Even though Fluke is amazing to eat 
I think everything will be alright




Fish On

for us, the sport fisherman, I agree with you fishon, unfortunatly we share our sport with people who make a living.  This is a debate where I have to stand in the middle with.  I don't agree with all the changing with size and bag limits of fish, BUT...  I can't let them take it out of my soul, which is where I agree with you fishon..  Now that your back, I will let you know next time im on the boat, you can join me..

[hareball]

I really don't know what to say. i'm all for conservation and more times than not will throw a fish back that is considered just legal. fluke fishing is not my thing but it does seem that 90% of fisherman do target this specie and keep their share. now thats fine with me, it's not cheap running a boat nor is tackle and bait. it's great to stock the freezer and be able to eat our harvest as our ancestors did for survival. what I would like to see are the cold hard facts. I know there are some coastal states that do actual surveys. they grid the ocean floor and count all life for each area and come back the following year and do the same thing. I feel our local species deserve the same attention and believe our local species deserve it.

I don't know the facts about our striper's but heard we nearly lost them 20 something years ago and through conservation they are back in good numbers. was this for real? did the authorities do an actual survey? I'd love to have faith in our leaders and believe their actions have saved species from extinction but would love to read the actual facts for their actions.

[hareball]

one other thing...."they" want to use 1930 as a benchmark for fluke population? ok, fine but what about the other species in the food chain? do they know if there will be enough food for the fluke to eat or are they going in blind and hope they all have enough to eat and thrive?

[Capt. Ed]

Hi Hareball,

Exactly!

How one can set goals for one specific species without taking into consideration the interaction of all species and the state of the water and estuaries is beyond reasonable.

Also, you knows what the biomass was at any point of time, never mind back in 1930.

Nick - I agree with your position. I just feel bad for the people who try to stretch their money by catching some fish for themselves and/or their families.

The void between the haves and have nots just keeps getting wider in this country.

Ed

[Luna Sea 5]

Certain things I can agree with..  If they raise the size limit of fish, then that can give the fish one more year of maturity and possible one more year of breeding which inturn will help the population grow.  Unfortunatly with the abundance of bluefish, sand sharks, skates, etc... that will each the young fluke, this also hurts the population of fluke.  Think about how many eggs are laid per fish, then think about how many survive.  The bag limit is also a factor.  If I catch 2 good keepers, thats all I personally need for the table, 4 if I am feeding my family.  To catch alot of fish and putting it in the freezer is a waste for me.  If thats the case, I will go to the store and buy frozen fish.  I do not freeze fish.  The best part of being a fisherman is that you get a chance to eat the freshest fish you can every want.  Beats any market. 

[Capt. Ed]

Hi Nick,

Well put ... I am much the same.

The one thing that I cannot understand is why they keep increasing the size limit. At first, it sounds like the right thing to do.

However, the bigger the fluke, the higher the probability that it is a female, and a sexually mature one at that.

You would think they would put a slot of say 14 to 18 inches (I think the comms get 14 inch fish but I may be wrong - is it 12???). Then you stand a chance that some males and females are taken.

The big problem with me is that this has been going on for the better part of 10 yrs. and these folks still cannot make a good decision.

Oh well ... back to fishing in the AM.

Are you going out? If so, best of luck!

Ed

[ped579]

Hi All,

I have to agree with everything that has been said here but I hope everyone realizes that just by raising quotas weather it be by size or limit is not going to fix the overall problem.  It is like putting gum in the crack in the dam.  Yeah, it might hold for a while but sooner or later the dam will burst.

We and I mean everyone especially those who have the power to make change have to look at the system and realize the problem does not solely lie with the fishermen be they recreational or commercial.  The root of the problem starts way up stream (sorry for the pun)so to speak.   Our rivers and estuaries are being bombarded with from fertilizers rich in nitrogen, sewer runoffs, animal feces leaching into small creeks, simply put, over population is taking its toll.  We allowed out towns to grow at alarming rates and this is the price we have to pay.  Our bays are slowly dieing which means the rich spawning grounds for many species could be no more.

I hate to get political but here lies another problem.  Why do towns have to grow so large along the coastline of our country?  Because that is how most small towns get their revenues, TAX THE MASSES.  Look around and you will find that most coastal towns do not have large industry to fill their coffers to defray the cost of local infrastructures.  Plus there is a little known fact why towns grow so large and it is called affordable housing.  Most towns rely on grants handed out to local towns if they factor into their building plan affordable housing.

Yes, I is great living in or near a coastal area I have been in Toms River since 1967 and have seen it grow from a small township to the 10th largest municipality in the state.  With all that population encroaching the watershed sooner or later it had to reach its  ecological limit.  Where humanization has overtaken the ecosystems ability to fight back.

All I am trying to say is that there is more to this than meets the eye.  We have to change our ways of thinking but not to go to extremes like the environmental wackos would have us do.

Moderation here will go a long way to fix the problem without being over zealous and have us swing the pendulum too far to the right only to have it swing back and hit us in the back while we were not looking.

Get involved is the key to help solve this disaster waiting to happen.  Talk, discuss, create a plan of action you feel comfortable and follow it.  Don't bury your head in the sand on this one, there is a lot at steak here.

Sorry for the long post again...

Happy Catching

Paul

[Capt. Ed]

Hi Paul,

It could not have been said better. Actually, I have never seen it better said in so few lines!

Capt. Ed

[CapBob]

As the song says "nothing from nothing leaves nothing"

They are well on the way to killing what is left of the recreational sport fishery, and at the same time allowing the commercial side just go merraly along.

(I am not bashing commercial fishermen, as three generations of my family made their living at it)

Several times I have written to the various fisheries management with Data I have from my father and great Uncles commercial logs, spanning40 some years. You can clearly see the differant fish cycles, just like the tides they peak and then ebb. A deaf ear was turned, I have been involved with JCAA and RFA only to see them rebuffed.

Some say well we will just catch and release, the problem is that depending on the species and how the fish is handed (and most handle them badly) you have between a 20-40% mortality rate. Just handling a fish you break the slime barrier and the get a fungus that will kill them.

Not that I agree (but can fully understand) The system is forcing the average person into breaking the regulations.

A man takes his family on a Charter or Party boat spends hard earned cash to go home with not enough fish to feed the family. Granted most are just doing it for enjoyment, but some actually count on getting a bucket of fish.

I have people on my boat catch 60 fish and can only keep 10 of them, 10 divided by 4 comes to 2.5 fish per person, and how many of the throwbacks died that could have been put to use??

AS they said on the Little Rascals "hey where you goin? I don't know but I'm on my way!"

[ped579]

TOOT TOOT, here comes the political railroad.

The fishery management is going the same route FEMA has been going for years.  They are relying to heavily on the perceived education of a certain group of people and not enough on the talent that comes from the school of hard Knox (and yes education).  The big problem is how do you get those in power to stop burying their noses so deep up certain influential  groups butts that their eyes have turned brown.

I could tell you stories about emergency management that could make your head spin.  Another story another time.  But the scenario is the same those that speak the loudest and carry the big stick win.  The little guy does not stand a chance.  But a bunch of little guys together might have a chance.  We have to come up with the right weapon and hit the most vulnerable spot.

Paul

[IrishAyes]

TOOT TOOT, here comes the political railroad.

  The big problem is how do you get those in power to stop burying their noses so deep up certain influential groups butts that their eyes have turned brown.

  We have to come up with the right weapon and hit the most vulnerable spot.

Paul

Paul, that would be by voting these idiots out of office.  Make it know through newspaper articles and any media possible why these individuals were voted against.  We have to make it perfectly clear that if you screw with us, you will be the one who gets it in the end.  If their management was sincere and affective, it would be a different story.  But to allow a handful of unknowedgable people dictate what can be done is intolerable.

[ped579]

It is scary but that is the way this country is run.  Most of the departments state, county, and local are run by incompetents that got to their position through either political ties or family power.  Just take a walk through any government building and talk to anyone or call on the phone and you become instantly aware they have no clear answers about anything.

This state is so corrupt it is scary to think how we function at all.

Paul