Help Provide Fisheries Data

[CaptTB]

The state started an on-line angler survey last year, and had a fairly good response. Many people do not know that out of the 700,000 to 1,000,000 anglers that fish in NJ in any given year, our landings for ALL SPECIES are determined by only a FEW THOUSAND intercepts. That's right, with as many as 4-5 MILLION angler trips being made in a year, the Marine Recreational Fisheries Statistics Survey (MRFSS) samples but a few thousand of those individual anglers and then expands the catch throughout the fishery (meaning the fishermen who prosecute our fisheries in this state)

New Jersey has always been one of the front running states when it came to trying to improve the data we have and to try and manage our fisheries the best way possible. I know this from first hand experience dealing with the state on many many issues over the years. Despite the fact that often things seem pretty bleak in various fisheries, we are actually some of the lucky ones when it comes to the state being on our side.

Having dealt with state officials from other states over the years I can tell you from first hand experience that fishermen in many other states do not have the kind of support that we do from our Division of Fish and Wildlife.

In the past the state has used data at their disposal that other states either did not have or did not use (like our Striped Bass Bonus Tag Information) to support the arguments or positions the state was taking.

Good data can NEVER hurt us. Accurate data can NEVER hurt us.

Please check out the on-line angler survey by clicking the link below. If and when you use it, please be honest and please be as accurate as possible. Also, pay attention to the questions asked, they may make you pay a little closer attention to the types of things to look for and remember when you are fishing, so that information you enter later into a survey can be accurate and the type of information needed to manage our fisheries.

If anyone has any questions about it, I will put another post in this thread detailing why it is important to have accurate data and why it is VITAL that people DO NOT underestimate or over estimate what they did or did not catch. BOTH can be equally harmful to the fishermen. Putting less than you really caught CAN BE JUST AS DAMAGING AS PUTTING MORE than you caught.

Check it out, see what you think. Remember, the state made this survey, not me, so please direct any technical or procedural questions as well as any suggestions to the state, not to me!

NJ Angler Survey

[IrishAyes]

Thanks for the info. Survey site added to my bookmarks and will be using it this season. 

[Hotrod]

This is Great.. I hope it helps us in the determination of our Fishing Regulations.

[wb]

I checked my logs for June '08- 325 fluke caught on 7 trips, with 3 total keepers. Either I suck or the regulations do; maybe both. Here are my comments I left on the NJ fisheries angler survey:

EXCEPTIONAL CATCH INFORMATION:   Please provide information on any exceptional or unusual catches not listed above, such as trophy size, unusual species, disease, tag recaptures, etc.

Only 3 keepers in over 300 fish landed- THAT is exceptional. Actually taking home a fish, priceless. The rule was 17-7/8", the exception was a keeper.
Thanks for allowing flawed science to ruin it for the recreational angler!

GENERAL COMMENTS:   Please feel free to provide any other comments you have.

What was so disheartening was that so many of them were right at 18 or just short of 18. There are more fish than ever but the regulations preclude me from feeding my family. How come the commercial draggers can keep a 14" fish and it is somehow OK? Also how come the Governor's Cup gets an exemption to allow keeping fluke during closed season? Make it a statewide exemption.

[Kenny]

I also added the site to my favorites.

I just hope the state dose not put a spin on the info that works against us.

[CaptTB]

I checked my logs for June '08- 325 fluke caught on 7 trips, with 3 total keepers. Either I suck or the regulations do; maybe both. Here are my comments I left on the NJ fisheries angler survey:

EXCEPTIONAL CATCH INFORMATION:   Please provide information on any exceptional or unusual catches not listed above, such as trophy size, unusual species, disease, tag recaptures, etc.

Only 3 keepers in over 300 fish landed- THAT is exceptional. Actually taking home a fish, priceless. The rule was 17-7/8", the exception was a keeper.
Thanks for allowing flawed science to ruin it for the recreational angler!

GENERAL COMMENTS:   Please feel free to provide any other comments you have.

What was so disheartening was that so many of them were right at 18 or just short of 18. There are more fish than ever but the regulations preclude me from feeding my family. How come the commercial draggers can keep a 14" fish and it is somehow OK? Also how come the Governor's Cup gets an exemption to allow keeping fluke during closed season? Make it a statewide exemption.

Wb, one thing to remember is the state does not have a choice in the approved regs. anything under 18" was not allowed by the ASMFC unless you cut the season back by weeks or months (depending on how low you wish to go)

The state does not determine the methodology used, the ASMFC and NMFS do. The state can only present the options to the public that are first approved by ASMFC. While you, me and everyone else I know has problems with the state in one form or another, the frustration directed at them when it comes to our fluke regs is misplaced.

The people who need to get their act together are NMFS and the ASMFC. The state can propose anything it wants, but if it is not approved by ASMFC they are voted out of compliance and the entire fishery is shut down, commercial AND recreational until the state does comply (like what almost happened with Blackfish recently)

If the state has more info and more accurate info than MRFSS provides it gives the state the ability to move beyond the feds numbers and work in more creative ways. That's the whole point of this survey, to improve upon the crappy data the state is forced to work with from NMFS.

As to the Governor's cup, you can argue the exemption, everyone has an opinion on it and I personally don't care about it eaither way.

It cannot, however, be a statewide exemption because it would be too high a number of fish. ASMFC would treat that as one more full day of season. If that were allowed in the first place the season would be one day longer.

Again, I'm not arguing the point of the tournament, just explaining why one thing would be allowed and the other would not. Some people hold the belief that it's a single tournament with a limited number of people and it allows fishermen and their families to do something special. Others hold to the belief that if they can't do it, no one should. I will not debate those two points, as I said I am not interested in that argument.

[wb]

Some people hold the belief that it's a single tournament with a limited number of people and it allows fishermen and their families to do something special.

Something special would be 8 fish at 17" from the Saturday before Memorial Day to Labor Day, inclusive. But that's NEVER coming back regardless of the fishery condition. Even a slot limit of say, 2 at 17" and 6 at 18" would make a world of difference in my keeper ratio. So I'm sure forget that as well. 6 at 18" don't make much difference from 8 at 18" if all you're getting is 17-7/8".

Something special would be a keeper is a keeper is a keeper regardless of how caught or by who. Again, requiring new nets for the draggers ain't gonna happen either.

Obviously the fluke are smarter than me because they know to grow to 17-7/8" and then put on girth only. So many of those throwbacks were thick healthy fish that would have made a nice meal. But hey so does a thin anemic 14" fish  according to the Feds and the draggers.

Something special will be the "Elongata de la flatpescadora" device I am perfecting and will have functional before May starts. Let's just say last year's performance will be significantly improved. I can't describe details but the term "stretching your options" comes to mind....

[Bucktail]

Thanks for the information TB!  I have also bookmarked the survey!

[CaptTB]

Some people hold the belief that it's a single tournament with a limited number of people and it allows fishermen and their families to do something special.

Something special would be 8 fish at 17" from the Saturday before Memorial Day to Labor Day, inclusive. But that's NEVER coming back regardless of the fishery condition. Even a slot limit of say, 2 at 17" and 6 at 18" would make a world of difference in my keeper ratio. So I'm sure forget that as well. 6 at 18" don't make much difference from 8 at 18" if all you're getting is 17-7/8".

Something special would be a keeper is a keeper is a keeper regardless of how caught or by who. Again, requiring new nets for the draggers ain't gonna happen either.

Obviously the fluke are smarter than me because they know to grow to 17-7/8" and then put on girth only. So many of those throwbacks were thick healthy fish that would have made a nice meal. But hey so does a thin anemic 14" fish  according to the Feds and the draggers.

Something special will be the "Elongata de la flatpescadora" device I am perfecting and will have functional before May starts. Let's just say last year's performance will be significantly improved. I can't describe details but the term "stretching your options" comes to mind....

I'm sorry, would you like some cheese with that Whine?

Don't fill out the survey, don't do anything, just Pee and moan on the internet, I'm not trying to convince you of anything. What I am doing is pointing out where you are incorrect in directing your frustration, since blaming people who don't make the decision doesn't exactly make a whole lot of sense to me, nor will it accomplish anything.

I'm sorry if I upset you by correcting you, but your comments about "what is special" has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of the Tournament, but, do whatever makes you happy

What about everything else in my post? You took one sentence and applied it to something totally unrelated. I'm sorry if I seem a little sarcastic, I did not want to attack you, honestly.

My frustration is when people will rail and scream against "the system" but don't even direct their frustration at the right part of that system. It's everyone's god given right to complain, please don't mistake my comments for something other than my own form of complaining!!

I don't know you (I don't think  ) so I do not mean to pass judgement.

However, instead of going off on tangents let's talk about why things are the way they are and how to try and improve them!!

I've heard an awful lot of comments lately (actually, I've read them on message boards) about "not being able to fight city hall," "it doesn't matter what we do," etc. However, the reality of it is we have fought city hall and won, and we have changed things in certain fisheries for the better. It takes time, commitment, effort and of course MONEY!

At the same time, sure some things are worse (more than are better in my opinion) and it is probably more of an uphill battle than ever before.

I've said this before and I'll say it till the day I die:

I fight the battles worth fighting, not just the ones I think I can win.

I look forward to having a productive discussion with you and others about the challenges we face.

[Capt -Jerry P]

Thanks For the great info Capt Tony!!!

[wb]

No worries CaptTB; nor any need to be sorry, it's not your fault man. Keep doing what you do. 

I'd rather have beer than cheese, as long as you're buying, thanks. No drama or whining here either, just venting-- feels good, even tho it likely won't do any good.

I fish cuz it's fun-- I feel for others (but not you necessarily) who need or want to take it too seriously. Hey if it's all you got then I can understand-- go with it.

[CaptTB]

I'd rather have beer than cheese, as long as you're buying, thanks.

I prefer Molson, but anything other than Bud in a can will do nicely!!

[wb]

good then I will buy